The whole idea of this excercise was to remove restrictions, namely the AFM, throttle body and inlet piping. IC is 3 times bigger etc. So flow should be way better. Air box on the inlet and down pipe on the exhaust the only room for improvement.
Now Johan, I am asking because we need to understand what happened. So may be I ask stupid questions.
1. Stock turbo - will it be capable and or able to push through your bigger IC? Can a IC be to big?
2. Stock turbo and bigger TB. For one momento I understand you want less restriction, but on the other side TB to big - cant fill the plennum properly.(This sounds stupid to me saying it myself Can it be possible?
3. What is the base timing now? Was there any timing advance involved?
4. Who was operating the laptop while tuning? Francois?(He has done a great job with my unichip(latest version).
Just trying to understand what on earth happened with your car. I must say the turbo bothers me.
The whole idea of this excercise was to remove restrictions, namely the AFM, throttle body and inlet piping. IC is 3 times bigger etc. So flow should be way better. Air box on the inlet and down pipe on the exhaust the only room for improvement.
Now Johan, I am asking because we need to understand what happened. So may be I ask stupid questions.
1. Stock turbo - will it be capable and or able to push through your bigger IC? Can a IC be to big?
2. Stock turbo and bigger TB. For one momento I understand you want less restriction, but on the other side TB to big - cant fill the plennum properly.(This sounds stupid to me saying it myself Can it be possible?
3. What is the base timing now? Was there any timing advance involved?
4. Who was operating the laptop while tuning? Francois?(He has done a great job with my unichip(latest version).
Just trying to understand what on earth happened with your car. I must say the turbo bothers me.
1. Sure it battles.... at .6 bar. Why did they not bother to increase the boost? If they where unsure, why not phone me? They did for everything else. The IC is not very big, the lag is very very little. Throttle response good. If the IC was to big and the turbo to small, the lag would have been huge, specially on a autobox.
2. Again, no lag. Yes it is ready for a BIG mother of a turbo now... but that turbo is capable of at least 155 rwkw like what they did on their own SX. On that 1 they simply added another IC about the same size as my new one in line with the existing std IC. So they ran the same turbo and a bigger cooler and made 155 rwkw?
3. Will check later when I connect the laptop to the Consult port. It used to be 15 deg.
4. Was not present at the time, but Francois soldered in the Unichip and MAF, but is seems that Martin was involved as well at least with the test drive.
Sure I am also confused about all of this. Specially if I was assured before hand that these upgrade would make a HUGE difference... 6 rwkw.
Sorry to hear that Johan. The only guy that I can recommend is just down the road from me, Ross at RBTS Racing - 0119794428, however this is in Bredell by JHB Int Airport. I did phone Smart once with some questions and got a lot of attitude from them, the previous owner Hannes Minaar gets 5 stars from me for his level of service, he lives in PTA West, rather phone him - 0848006801
Good luck, I hope you come right.
Diesel power, hmm, yes, I think I'll have some of that.
Ok, this is presisely why I did not want to go back to maus....
Hannes does not work at Smart racing anymore....in anyway he did not do the tuning, he does the building and he is very good, his brother Johan does the dina, he is also good, he did my car and although I got the same results as before(on a different dina) my petrol use seems to be much better, I was there the whole time he did it and it was a good job, I was impressed with his friendlyness and advice, he never made me feel unwelcome or that I am wasting his time...as was the case at maus.
Johan I don't know if you will do better numbers at Johan, although I can't see why not, but I know you will get better service.
Im sorry guys but this is why I don't trust tuners as far as I can throw them .
The S-14 Black-Top has one of the best turbo's in the Nissan's range , I have been trying to get my hands on one for some time but money is the issue.
The turbo is Very, Very close to the flow rates and power outputs of a GT28R, just without the ball-bearing cart.
You will be able to easily push 150Rwkw on that turbo without much work. I'm also not a fan on Uni-chips, piggyback , xms what ever. There is a possibility this could also be your issue maybe a bikiROM is a better route but I don't think this is your issue.
But lets cover the basics before another tuner touch's your car again.
Hows the Compression on you motor?
How do the plugs look?
Base timing?
Could there be a boost leak?
Could the stock BOV be leaking?
Any shaft play on the turbo?
I'm sure Sokar's old S-14 put out more power with just an exhaust.
So there must be something up somewhere.
Phinx wrote:
The turbo is Very, Very close to the flow rates and power outputs of a GT28R, just without the ball-bearing cart.
You will be able to easily push 150Rwkw on that turbo without much work. I'm also not a fan on Uni-chips, piggyback , xms what ever. There is a possibility this could also be your issue maybe a bikiROM is a better route but I don't think this is your issue.
But lets cover the basics before another tuner touch's your car again.
Hows the Compression on you motor?
How do the plugs look?
Base timing?
Could there be a boost leak?
Could the stock BOV be leaking?
Any shaft play on the turbo?
Also not a piggy back fan, but for what I intended, plenty good.
Motor has done about 40 000km since a complete as new rebuild. Uses no oil etc.
New plugs
Will check what is is set to later when I connect the consult.
Maus should have picked that if if any, reported and/or fixed it.
BOV is fine, slightly modified.
Turbo fine
Hennie Marais wrote:but like I said, many other factor does affect it, like a restrictive stock intercooler, exhaust system, boost pipes, etc.
The whole idea of this excercise was to remove restrictions, namely the AFM, throttle body and inlet piping. IC is 3 times bigger etc. So flow should be way better. Air box on the inlet and down pipe on the exhaust the only room for improvement.
That's excatly what I mean by other factors, if the old ones were a restrictionto the turbo, it would have improved the flow to the engine by changing them, but that's if they restricted the max flow of the turbo, but if the stock ones could flow the max the turbo can, then they were not a restriction, then it means the turbo couldn't supply enough air for the engine, so by upgrading it you will not realise better flow, maybe better efficiency by cooling the air more. See what I mean. But if that is the case then by upgrading the turbo now, will give way better results by being able to supply the air needed by the engine.
The closest to the stock T28 turbo is the GT2854 which has a max flow of +-27lbs = 270hp = 202kw at the flywheel = 150rwkw with 25%loss. so you're max of the turbo is 150rwkw.
Hennie Marais wrote:The closest to the stock T28 turbo is the GT2854 which has a max flow of +-27lbs = 270hp = 202kw at the flywheel = 150rwkw with 25%loss. so you're max of the turbo is 150rwkw.
Spot on. So where did the missing 25 rwkw go? If at least to got to like 140+, yes, they tried, but 125 is not realistic.
Hennie Marais wrote:do they use a ambient correction on their dyno printout.
Maus is a high profile tuner, doing work for Nissan Motorsport etc. Their dyno should be the best, reliable etc. etc.... It was raining the morning during the dyno. Doubt that the ambient correction will affect more than a few %. Even at 5%, we are talking like 6-7 kw. If it was 140kw plus, I would have been happy. The car also feels the same as before (Unichip+xhaurts) on my butt dyno.
Dastek had a go at it when I fitted the X-Force stainless branch, they said it produced 163 rwkw, but I could never get the dyno graph out of them. The car was in fact way slower, specially at top end.
The only crowd that impressed me so far was Bonus spars. The 1st AFM was a dud. The second run out of steam on half throttle. When I returned it, they phoned around to help me, got a discount so that I did not need to pay anything extra for a brand new Z33 AFM
Way to go guys.
Answer I got from the other SX forum I frequent....
Front mount and piping seem a little small - and wondering why you "flowed" the head? SRs flow quite well up to around 500 flywheel. Also wondering why you didnt do anything with the turbo? Or Injectors? That will be your limiting factor around 200rwkw is the most you could reliably get.
Regards,
Jeff Ash
Managing Director - C-Red Tuning - www.c-red.com.au
and when I told him about the +6rwkw...
*cough*
Its a bit soft in the power stakes, 6rwkw is barely 15hp at the flywheel. For your money you'd be expecting a lot more.
Regards,
Jeff Ash
Managing Director - C-Red Tuning
