Project F

Gary57 · Post by **Gary57** » Fri Nov 02, 2007 8:34 am

Because your tempreture gauge works off the water tempreture, if there is no water the gauge cant work. That is why Ferarri's AND Alfa's (yes VC Alfa's) use oil tempreture as tempreture gauge or have a seperate gauge for that.

I miss my oil temp gauge

Draco · Post by **Draco** » Fri Nov 02, 2007 8:37 am

Freddy....hear what I said....Ero just confirmed what I speculated.

WooHaa · Post by **WooHaa** » Fri Nov 02, 2007 11:48 am

Gary57 wrote:Because your tempreture gauge works off the water tempreture, if there is no water the gauge cant work. That is why Ferarri's AND Alfa's (yes VC Alfa's) use oil tempreture as tempreture gauge or have a seperate gauge for that.

I miss my oil temp gauge

That would cause you not too have a leak.
no water in the system.
gary is 100% right.

ChemCool · Post by **ChemCool** » Fri Nov 02, 2007 3:34 pm

So ,if there is no water in the system, why does the meter still display normal temp and not falling down to zero??? What is it reading then? Hot air?

Draco · Post by **Draco** » Fri Nov 02, 2007 3:38 pm

Ok now i understand what you meant, the heat guege went to the normal temp but did not show that it was overheating.....that makes more sense, now I am even more worried....

ChemCool · Post by **ChemCool** » Fri Nov 02, 2007 3:47 pm

But, thinking about it again. Yes no water the temp meter cant messure, which is true. The water must be there. So with hot water leaking out some pipes, nothing to messure. So we need the temp sens to tell us the water is below a certain level, hot or cold. That must be extra then.

When do you get then HG damage? While all hot water is still in there or no water in there at all or both cases?

So if the water is leaking out, this bloody temp gauge of us must then rather fall on the meter back to zero, which can give me some indication that there is no water in the system. Mine stayd there on normal temp the whole time?

Chem

WooHaa · Post by **WooHaa** » Fri Nov 02, 2007 4:04 pm

Your HG, can blow even if the system is full of water. If the temp goes too high, it blows.
Maybe in your case, there was enough water in the system, to give you a reading.
Test the temp sensor manually. When car is warmed up, switch on ignition, (don't start...just so dash boad lights are on) then pull the wire of the sensor & see if the gauge drops.

Steam, might also mean that it's is leaking onto something hot, which is the reason for steam.
Have you tested your thermostat? (Put in hot water & see if it opens?

veecee · Post by **veecee** » Fri Nov 02, 2007 7:53 pm

hey guys...

aluminium takes some time to cool down!!!

the water temp sensor is screwed into an aluminium housing!!!

yes - it wont read properly if it is not in direct contact with the substance it is measuring temperature for, but it is in contact with the water housing, and i reckon thats why it didnt drop in temperature.

how long does it take for your sx to cool down after a trip. its not instant! so you should expect the water temp sensor to react the same way???

ChemCool · Post by **ChemCool** » Fri Nov 02, 2007 9:27 pm

Great, now it is sorted.Thanks.

Toby · Post by **Toby** » Sat Nov 03, 2007 11:23 am

Well yes, I can confirm that when there is no water in the radiator system, the temp sensor reads normal. Happened to me when a radiator hose blew, threw out all the water, but my temp sensor showed normal reading, so I carried on driving for 25km furthur

Needless to say, head gasket blew.

Vlade · Post by **Vlade** » Sat Nov 03, 2007 4:08 pm

ChemCool wrote:Great, now it is sorted.Thanks.

Great that's the important bit... now... how's the rest of your issues?

ChemCool · Post by **ChemCool** » Sat Nov 03, 2007 5:59 pm

Ok, replaced the vrot water pipe that caused the leak. Again I could not reach the pipe with my hands and had to call on my oldest son to assist.
It was the pipe adjacent to the one that goes to the oil cooler and then connects to the firewall going inside the cabin. Not easy man, not easy.
Here is a picture of Eben mounting the engine to reach easier.

The rest is still the same. Will give attention to the lifters when I open rocker covers for head torque. Hope then by that time tthat we will have the money available to replace those little round things. In the mean time uphold the idle by adjusting the small little idle screw under the butterfly wheel.

I also checked and tested the A.A.C valve by removing the whole lot. it is working fine. It is clean. it is showing the correct resistance and relay operates fine when voltage added. Even noticed how the inside shaft thingetjie moves accordingly and which is then not stucked at all.

ChemCool · Post by **ChemCool** » Sun Nov 04, 2007 11:57 pm

First things first: Thanks Barend for your visit to my place today. We are going to win these CA18's. Thanks for your input and guidence.

Ok, let me try and summarize this project as it is now:
Today Vlade and I tried to establish the rough idle or actually the stalling of my engine.

We checked the air regulator, which seems fine. The idle screw has no influence in turning it in or out.

Eventually we find a worrying situation. When engine running (remember I keep the engine on idle with butterfly screw adjusted), we opened the oil filler cap and air pressure releases out. In other words air is pushed out of the oil filler hole. Not sucking (no vacuum) but definitely blowing out and very strongly!

Now some background. I bought nice 0.5 pistons from Nissan with 1mm oversized ring set wrongfully supplied. Then I went and bought the right ring set for 0.5 mm. from Alert Spares in Pta. A good quality though.
So, I think the engine experience “blow – by”. Either by ring gaps to big or all over fit still not matching the pistons. OR rings did not seat properly.
If the above reasons are positive, I still don’t know if that also causes the stalling of the engine from start on?
Then I also noticed that the engine temp goes up very quickly to normal reading, which I am not used to.
I have done a cylinder compression test before, which showed all four cylinders exactly the same reading of 800. (Which personally worries me, because it differs from the min of the manual)?
Some how I suspect the head gasket, but don’t see definite reasons or signs of that?
With the above, I need to ask questions on proper valve seating as well (stalling of engine?????) I just don’t know.

There are no other obvious signs like water in the oil or vice versa, but I will double check any way.
I also want to check oil pressure more accurately than only my guesso meter, because something is worrying me about it, and I can’t define it properly right now?
Then apart from the noisy hydraulic lifters, which I feel can be addressed by replacing all or some of them, I am now more sure about the krrr.... sound or what ever sound. When tapping off (engine under load) the krrrr.... sound manifests. Like during gear changes in the region of 2.5 to 3000 rpm. This must be some rod bearings. Main bearings are similar but are tested differently like accelerating up hill or similar and I don’t experiences noises that way.
This time around I need to eliminate all these and try and establish exactly what the situation is. I am not giving up at all, although my budget has giving up a year ago already. Also it is time consuming and a real transport problem for me.
Somehow I feel that I will pull the engine again and redo. I need to do that and I am honest in saying that I am learning the hard way. All I know is that next time I have to ask more questions and make sure engineering is done 100% etc. I defenitely slip with the hydraulic lifters.

I definitely need your opinion and comments on the above situation. I don’t mind negative comments at all. Eventually I will come out of this and will then be in a position to give good advice to others who may need it.
Between all the difficulties, I feel the challenge becomes bigger for me and I like it!

BTW: The downpipe catches the firewall some times(need to redo this job) and make terrible noises inside the car. The moral of the story is that i am driving the crappiest s13 sx ever.

Vlade · Post by **Vlade** » Mon Nov 05, 2007 7:13 am

Oil filter cap... you mean the Valve cover cap...

Yeah there is some blow by there it blows very positively lot more than I'm used too (Freddy we checked ring caps, and piston clearance so that should be fine)

if we take of the hoses to the breather inlet, the car also dies, this drives me to the fact that the car is not getting enough air.

Air regulator does nothing, pressure regulator does nothing, idle screw does nothing, AAC valve does work removing it causes the engine to stall.

We also blocked of hoses to Air Regulator had no influence, same goes for pressure regulator.

Baffled by the fact that the engine won't idle without breather hoses connected.

Engine response is really crap, you open butterfly and it responds but not very quick, when you close it, the engine revs take long to drop.

Could not hear/see any air leaks...

Sorry I couldn't be more of assistance Freddy

veecee · Post by **veecee** » Mon Nov 05, 2007 7:43 am

anybody check the PCV valve on the back ofthe intake plenum???

how about vacuum hosing?

can you hear the engine sucking in air anywhere?